American captive beheaded

[DudeAsInCool]

Hmmm...Im afraid in a situation like this, I have to put my anti-capital punishment and pacifist leanings aside - the perpetrators have the most vile minds on the planet and deserve to live a life of nothingness...

[desdemona]

Ken, I didn't watch the video but those images crossed my mind, just as you described them. I'm sorry to feel this way but I just think those men are nothing more than animals that did this. I still believe our cultures are so basically different, religion is woven into their govt and politics, you can't seperate it, and a democracy should be absent of those influences. I can't see how this will work. I'm starting to see men in the military question why they're there, saadam wasn't connected to al quaeda, he hated osama, there were no wmd's, there was no eminent threat, no ties to 9/11, nothing to justify a first strike. I just wish politicians would admit their mistakes and do something to correct them, instead of treading down the wrong path. Congress is just as much to blame for passing the vote to go to war, some of these elected officials need to suck it up and admit their mistakes and take action. I respect what the military has done, sacrificed, but I don't think they should sacrifice more for a people that do not want an american democracy. I think it's time to let them choose, do their own thing, leave, and not let the door hit us in the butt on the way out.

[Ken]

I have to put my anti-capital punishment and pacifist leanings aside

Some stick to these ideals, even after witnessing such acts.

What they don't realize, is that it's human nature to feel injustice, even hatred towards such people, and that sometimes, a pacifist approach doesn't solve anything, and leaves people in misery.

Sometimes, certain things need to be gotten rid of.

Sad, but true.

[Ken]

If this is in retaliation for the improper treatment of our prisoners, then go find some americans and sodomize them. A sore ass is much better than losing your head. Do unto others as they have done to you. Don't have enough Americans captive? Maybe you should have left your guns at home. You're just pissing a major world power off even more with your display of "power."

True, but what angers me is the blindness some people have towards a situation like this. They don't process it the right way.

Nick Berg didn't do anything wrong. He was an innocent human being. You don't extract revenge on an innocent human being.

We're supposed to have the ability to reason, to have deep emotion, to innovate, but actions like this revert us to our primative roots, which is somewhere we don't need to visit anymore.

[DudeAsInCool]

Unfortunately, anyone who would do such an act is not human...

[MoonMan]

I was against this war from the beginning. I think it was started for the wrong reasons, even FALSE reasons.

When I hear about things like this though, I want to hurt these people more. I want to destroy their very way of life. I keep having to tell myself that this is a terrible and stupid way to think but it's hard to keep that mindset. I wonder if that makes me a bad person or bigot.

I'm torn on if I want to view this video or not. From what I have heard and what I've seen Ken say, probably not. Yet, my curiosity continues to drive forward. Who, besides Ken, has opted to actually view this ?

[Ken]

Many in the media are viewing it, so they can describe the situation to their audience. It's on IRC and the newsgroups.

I don't know if anyone at BeatKing has seen it.

I chose to see it, because I wanted to view the reality of murder. I wanted to see the human beings commit these acts I only hear about (e.g. Daniel Pearl, other hostage killings). I wanted to know they deserve to die, before I said it.

What irritates me even more though, is the fact that these spineless, pseudo-revolutionaries don't have the courage to show their faces! They wore traditional head garb, and veils.

What's the matter, afraid of something? I thought you were ready to fight and die? Don't want anyone to see your face?

You know why, they're not brave revolutionaries, their spineless, scared, corrupt individuals who want power. They're not Muslim, and I’m hard-pressed to call them human, but I do so anyway. Humanity can be this cruel, but it doesn't mean we have to accept it.

I hope they choke.

[Ken]

Want to hear something funny? Yes, I said funny. Even in the face of a decapitated body, there is humor in humanities ruthlessness.

They held the head up to the camera and said

"God is great".

Really now? If a god existed, he would not allow you to exist at all. If I was a god, I wouldn't.

Unlike Daniel Pearl (not to take away from him), Nick Berg was ALIVE when this occured.

I'm sure you've all seen the part of the tape where the armed creatures read from a piece of paper, while Berg is on his knees, facing the camera (wearing the red jump-suit).

What follows at the conclusion is the lot of them pushing him to the ground (why all of them? Too weak? Scared? Just sadistic? We'll never know), then Nick Berg screams as his head is cut SLOWLY from his body, everything in perfect detail on the video (the cutting lasted about 30-45 seconds). The head is held up, and the statement is made.

And so all doubt is removed.

The images are now burned behind my eyes.

[joeyz]

Jesus..............

[Ken]

I wonder if that makes me a bad person or bigot.

I don't want to scare you Moony, but it may be what makes you human.

Humans don't always react to inhumanity from a so-called "rational" point of view.

It's natural it would manifest itself this way.

[Ken]

On a side note to the Daniel Pearl thing….

There was a video for the Daniel Pearl decapitation. Unlike Berg however, Pearl was already dead when they cut his head from his body.

Apparently, he was shot first. How nice of them.

I've made up my mind. You know what? I urge everyone to see this. You need to look upon it with your eyes, and process the true nature of humanities lesser qualities.

[DudeAsInCool]

I urge everyone to see this.  You need to look upon it with your eyes, and process the true nature of humanities lesser qualities.

You are not wrong in suggesting this to prove your point - its a realistic one. But Im not going to view it for a different reason - if their purpose was to shock, I'm not going to give them the pleasure of participating in their gruesome publicity stunt... fuck 'em!

[Bombardier]

Yeah, I am definitely not ever going to see this.

[Ken]

if their purpose was to shock, I'm not going to give them the pleasure of participating in their gruesome publicity stunt... fuck 'em!

True, but to me, it seems they wanted to send the world a message. The whole "ignore them, and they will go away" idea wont work in this situation.

I just feel people need to see this, to meet this head on. Don't hide from reality.

[method77]

I've watched it many times. I've seen these type of acts before during the war in Chechnia when they cut Russian soldies head but they did it with an axe very fast. The soldiers were alive then too.

But this was ubsolutely the worst thing I've ever seen because it was done slowly and you could hear the man suffer

[DudeAsInCool]

There is no right or wrong decision, Ken. We have the same point of view, just different perspectives - at the end of the day we are in agreement as to the perpetrators. I particularly like your point about their blindfolds - if they really believed in their actions, they wouldn't hide their faces.

[Ken]

I've watched it many times. I've seen these type of acts before during the war in Chechnia when they cut Russian soldies head but they did it with an axe very fast. The soldiers were alive then too.

But this was ubsolutely the worst thing I've ever seen because it was done slowly and you could hear the man suffer

Yeah.

The Russians also did many misdeeds to the "rebels". There was the one where they took four prisoners, took them for a ride out in the middle of nowhere, blindfolded them, shot them (one survived), and then strapped explosives to them, and detonated them.

Unbelievably, one person survived this, and lived to tell the story (they left, thinking everyone was dead).