The Teflon President

[Kooperman]

Poll: No gain to Kerry from Bush's fall: The Associated Press

Updated: 11:09 a.m. ET May 07, 2004

WASHINGTON - Public opinion of President Bush’s handling of hot-button issues such as the economy and the war on terrorism is near the low point of his presidency, but Democratic rival John Kerry has been unable to capitalize on the Republican’s slide, an Associated Press poll found.

For the complete article click here:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4924238/

[Redneck4sure]

Well........Kerry's problems just break my heart. ;)

[Kooperman]

What breaks my heart is that we apparently don't have a viable alternative to the worst President and the most disfunctional and corrupt administration of my 52 year lifetime. It's not too late for the Democrats to have a McCain/Edwards or Edwards/McCain ticket. If things continue like this John McCain would be doing yet another service to his country by taking on the Bush Gestapo.

[Redneck4sure]

McCain is getting to be one of the better known democrats. I lost what respect I had for him a few years back.

[Kooperman]

I hope you're joking about John McCain. He's been a conscientious Republican Senator who also served his country in Viet Nam, being held POW for quite some time. His record is better than most in Washington, I guarantee you.

[NullsRevenge]

the Bush Gestapo.

I think its wrong to refer to anyone as a nazi or using nazi terms it goes too far and is offensive and sickening that it gets thrown around whenever someone on the extreeme left cant get their way on everything which seems to me how its done.

I find it pretty funny that Democrats think that they can get McCain a Republican to side with a party that he doesnt have much in common with just to help them beat Bush because they cant come up with anything other than partisan and nazi insults. Which seems is all the Democrats have is more negatives attacks, partisan rethortic, and increasing going to the extreeme.

The whole vietnam issue, which is pretty much all Kerry has been pushing is going to backfire, if it hasnt already. His long winded generic speeches arent going to work forever, and he cant hijack Bush's stance on issues like he did to his oppents in the primay because hes too liberal no one will believe him.

Kerry himself has probably hurt him more than anything. His whole the south doesnt matter comment in the primary, how he tried to push that he is Catholic but not professionally was just as pathetic as the comment he made about his wife's SUV.

[Wolfie]

I hope you're joking about John McCain. He's been a conscientious Republican Senator who also served his country in Viet Nam, being held POW for quite some time. His record is better than most in Washington, I guarantee you.

Agreed. If I ever vote Republican it would be for McCain.

[Cerebral_Assassin]

I say put all the states in a hat........pick one out and then take a phone book from that state open it up close your eyes twirl the finger and place it on the page and appoint that person President.

[Kooperman]

I think its wrong to refer to anyone as a nazi or using nazi terms it goes too far and is offensive and sickening that it gets thrown around whenever someone on the extreeme left cant get their way on everything which seems to me how its done.

Perhaps you should tell the Secretary of State those thoughts...he refers to Rumsfeld's Pentagon as the Gestapo, as Bob Woodward reveals in his new book.

Bush gave the order to his people to talk to Woodward. Powell's warnings to Bush that the war could backfire look prescient today. Moreover, Powell didn't hold back. Vice President Cheney had a "fever" to go to war, Powell said. Donald Rumsfeld's inner circle of civilian war planners' Office of Special Plans was a "Gestapo office," Powell said.

http://www.jsonline.com/enter/books/review...sp?format=print

[NullsRevenge]

I think its wrong to refer to anyone as a nazi or using nazi terms it goes too far and is offensive and sickening that it gets thrown around whenever someone on the extreeme left cant get their way on everything which seems to me how its done.

Perhaps you should tell the Secretary of State those thoughts...he refers to Rumsfeld's Pentagon as the Gestapo, as Bob Woodward reveals in his new book.

Bush gave the order to his people to talk to Woodward. Powell's warnings to Bush that the war could backfire look prescient today. Moreover, Powell didn't hold back. Vice President Cheney had a "fever" to go to war, Powell said. Donald Rumsfeld's inner circle of civilian war planners' Office of Special Plans was a "Gestapo office," Powell said.

http://www.jsonline.com/enter/books/review...sp?format=print

This thread isnt about Rumsfeld, its about Bush, and it doesnt matter if anyone else said it or its in some book, its still inappropiate and doesnt mean you have to go around calling people Nazis. I hope the next shocking political book that comes out tells everyone to jump off a bridge because i bet alot of people would do it.

I dunno about you but i expect anyone would be intelligent enough to state their opinion in a mature manner than to resorting to insults like that which go too far, and makes you seem that your intolerant of anyone who doesnt have the same political beliefs as you do and youll just be passed off because no one will respect or thing your crediable.

[Kooperman]

Rumsfeld is Bush's Secretary of Defense....I really hate to break that news to you, but it does indeed make him part of any Bush thread, just as any other member of his cabinet comes under his accountability. If Colin Powell thinks the Pentagon resembles the Gestapo in the way it's run, I won't argue with him. Rumsfeld has even taken to hiding information from his boss, President Bush, who was none to pleased to find out about the Iraq atrocities through the news media. What other secrets is Rumsfeld hiding from him?

And let me point this out to you....Comparing the way an administration is run to the Gestapo secrecy is not calling anyone a Nazi. Only someone who has no defense about the charge would create such a diversionary issue. Bush's cabinet members are notorious for their secrecy, rarely briefing Congress on important issues. Now the President is even out of the loop, apparently.

[Redneck4sure]

I hope you're joking about John McCain.

Not Joking.

I understand that he served his country in Vietnam and was taken prisoner. A lot of people were. I still say he is one of the best known democrats in the Republican party.

What Wolfie says is more proof of my point. Wolfie said, "Agreed. If I ever vote Republican it would be for McCain. "

Like I said, McCain is the best known democrat in the Republican party. If I ever vote Republican it would be for McCain. If Wolfie does not agree that he is a Democrat in the Republican party then why would he say that? Most left leaning people I have ever spoken to say the same thing. "I would vote for McCain if he were a Democrat". Why let his official party affiliation stop you? He is a Republican and I wouldn't vote for him on a bet........unless he is running against Kerry.

[Kooperman]

Not Joking.

I understand that he served his country in Vietnam and was taken prisoner. A lot of people were. I still say he is one of the best known democrats in the Republican party.

What Wolfie says is more proof of my point. Wolfie said, "Agreed. If I ever vote Republican it would be for McCain. "

Like I said, McCain is the best known democrat in the Republican party. If I ever vote Republican it would be for McCain. If Wolfie does not agree that he is a Democrat in the Republican party then why would he say that? Most left leaning people I have ever spoken to say the same thing. "I would vote for McCain if he were a Democrat". Why let his official party affiliation stop you? He is a Republican and I wouldn't vote for him on a bet........unless he is running against Kerry.

I see Wolfie's remark as being very respectful of what McCain has given to his country and also the remarkable common sense he shows. I would vote for him too, just as I've voted for other Republican Presidential candidates, because I feel he'd be the best man running for the job.

[NullsRevenge]

Rumsfeld is Bush's Secretary of Defense....I really hate to break that news to you, but it does indeed make him part of any Bush thread, just as any other member of his cabinet comes under his accountability. If Colin Powell thinks the Pentagon resembles the Gestapo in the way it's run, I won't argue with him. Rumsfeld has even taken to hiding information from his boss, President Bush, who was none to pleased to find out about the Iraq atrocities through the news media. What other secrets is Rumsfeld hiding from him?

And let me point this out to you....Comparing the way an administration is run to the Gestapo secrecy is not calling anyone a Nazi. Only someone who has no defense about the charge would create such a diversionary issue. Bush's cabinet members are notorious for their secrecy, rarely briefing Congress on important issues. Now the President is even out of the loop, apparently.

Oh is that why you named the thread The Teflon President and the article was about the election and not comments in books, others news events and etc. Which im sure those other topics have threads of their own here and so i dont buy your reason that its justified and just solidifies in my first post here where i point out that it seems that democrats seem to only have negative attacks and not any real plans or solutions.

You didnt say "gestapo secrecy" in your orginal post and although i dont truely think your completely sincere when you say that is what you were referring too because why didnt you just say that in the first place? Again if you wanted to make that point, then surely someone as intelligent as yourself could have expressed it in a more mature and civil manner.

[DudeAsInCool]

  Using nazi terms  goes too far and is offensive and gets thrown around whenever someone on the extreme left cant get their way 

I would add to Kooper's comments that its the moderate Republicans and ex Bush Admin officials. (authors Clark, Phillips, etc) who are using the term, and whom the Bush administration uses most of its vitriol against. With the exception of Colin Powell and Ms Rice, this is one of the most extremist administrations in history

'Can't get their way with what? WTF? I dont think anyone in democratic party expects to get any leeway from these folks...

• McKain doesnt have much in common with (Democrats)  

Really? He had more in common with them than he does with the group in the White House and has said so. But if you say so, please give specific examples.

•  All the Democrats have is more negatives attacks, partisan rethortic, and increasingly going to the extreme.  

More gibberish and labels. Again, please give specific examples. I too can turn a phrase, too, as it's what I do for a living... But give me a break and stop with the labels--theyr're boring and they're meaningless.

  • Kerry:  on the Vietnam issue 

Kerry has been in battle. Outside of Colin Powell, all the people in the Bush Administration have not.. My problem with them is that they don't seem to hesitate in sending our young into battle, when they have no idea what they are putting them throught. If they wanted to establish a democracy in the Middle East, then they should have told the American people of their plands, and not used 911 to clean up George Sr's mistakes. Further, I find this particularly hyporcritical when you remember all the criticism they used to give Clinton for not serving in the military.

  His long winded generic speeches

Im not a fan of Kerry's speeches, but they are alot better to GW's...GW speaks so drably about bread and butter issues, he might as well have been a Russian communist--in fact, he probably copied his speeches from them. "I want peace for the Iraqui people. I want jobs for the American people--some of dem dere people are hurting." No kidding, George...

  He  cant hijack Bush's stance on issues ...because hes too liberal 

Why would anywone want to hijack any of the Bush Admnistration's policies???!!! Bush's stances on the war, on the economy, on education, on health care, on the criminal justice, on civil liberties...ARE ALLL WRONG!!!

[Redneck4sure]

I voted for Phil Gramm when he was a democrat. The dems got tired of him because he voted the Repub side of several issues so he switched parties. I think McCain should do the same thing. If you are going to vote for the Dems more than the Repubs then resign and run for election as a Dem. That is what Gramm did and I think that is the right thing to do. I can paint myself green but it won't make a Martian.

I too am very respectful of what McCain did for his country in Vietnam. Many Democrats served their country with honor and I appreciate it. He is one of them.

If you can read this...thank a teacher.......and since it is in English.....thank a veteran.

[Kooperman]

Any President is responsible for the choices he makes in picking his cabinet. If those cabinet members fail at their jobs, quite often they're dumped, just as Presidents are if they reach an unacceptable level of failure. Your illogical prattle about this issue is unbecoming for one so astute in politics as you.

In regards to the Bush Gestapo remark....if the 1934-1935 St Louis Cardinals baseball team is called The Gashouse Gang, as they are, does that mean they work at a gas station pumping gas? No, it means that they played with a verve and intensity that saw them diving for balls and sliding hard into the bases. Same goes for the 1975-1976 Cincinnati Reds team, called the Big Red Machine...they weren't a machine but they were a team with fearsome power and lightning speed. Now let's take the Bush Gestapo....are they Nazis who are looking to kill Jews and establish a master race? No, quite obviously, the Bush Gestapo is an administration that is veiled in a paranoid secrecy with power plays going on among the members, much to the disadvantage of the country and also the President. Utilize some common sense please, instead of creating ludicrous scenarios.

[DudeAsInCool]

You didnt say "gestapo secrecy" in your orginal post and although i dont truly think your completely sincere when you say that is what you were referring too because why didnt you just say that in the first place? Again if you wanted to make that point, then surely someone as intelligent as yourself could have expressed it in a more mature and civil manner.

We don't question people's sincerity's here at BK, and we dont question their maturity, or label people's arguments in a personal way. Let's keep the discussions on the up and up...

except Redneck's 'cause he needs capped!

[NullsRevenge]

And 'can't get their way with what? WTF? I dont think anyone in democratic party expects to get any leeway from these folks...and that's the point...this is not a moderate administration.

Really? He had more in common with them than he does with the group in the White House and has said so. But if you say so, please give specific examples.

More gibberish and labels. Again, please give specific examples. I too can turn a phrase as it's what I do for a living...but if I do, I'm going to be specific

Kerry has been in battle. Outside of Colin Powell, all the people in the Bush Administration have not..yet they don't seem to hesitate in sending our young into battle... this frightens me, particularly when you remember all the criticism Clinton received from the same hypocrites

Im not a fan of Kerry's speeches. But they are alot better to GW's... who speaks so drably about bread and butter issues, he might as well have been a Russian communist.

Why would he want to hijack any of them. Bush's stances on the war, on the economy, on education, on health care, on the criminal justice, on civil liberties...ARE ALLL WRONG!!!

The old "divide and conquer" approach to posts heheh..

Cant get their way on policies, i dont think that too hard to see.

McCain is not a Democrat, if your claim had any merit then why isnt McCain a democrat? He has said that hes a Republican numerous times, that he supports the President numerous times if you want to know then go look it up yourself.

No my comments on the constant negative attacks with no solutions is not gibberish and labels, it was mentioned in the story that this thread linked too and its blantently obvious. Even in your post you concentrated on taking more shots at Bush, and on my post than anything else. Why isnt there a politics forum here filled with solutions from the Democrats on how they would fix all the problems if what you say everything is wrong was correct? But all i see is mainly more negative attacks than anythign else. Your statement and the reality that i see here contradict.

What happen 30 years ago doesnt really matter too much today, just because Kerry drove a boat in Vietnam doesnt make him a better commander in chief.

In fact in a article posted last month Kerry stance on Iraq today and in the future is the same as Bush. So they would both do pretty much the same thing. I believe that was a New York Times article and it was also on CNN if you want to look it up then please do so.

Yeah and i suppose its ALL WRONG!!!! because its not what the opposition wants to do which isnt exactly "ALL 100% RIGHT!!!" either..

[Redneck4sure]

We don't question people's sincerity's here at BK, and we dont question their maturity - let's keep the discussions on the up and up...

Okay.....but can I question their common sense and general intelligence? Anybody who is sober and votes democrat has got to be lacking in both!!

Note: Florida excluded

J/K!!

Don't shoot!!

[Redneck4sure]

I found a pic of the boat that Kerry commanded.

[NullsRevenge]

We don't question people's sincerity's here at BK, and we dont question their maturity - let's keep the discussions on the  up and up...

Then maybe people should mean what they say, rather than backpedal when someone questions it, and again if they meant it that way all along then why not simply post that in the first place? Its funny that you post that to me right after you make a long post doing just that to my post and there is no real rule on it so does this apply to everyone here and if so then why isnt in the guidelines or is this a "special rule" just for me or anyone else who questions someone on what they post and then try to backpedal?

Edited May 9, 2004 by NullsRevenge

[Kooperman]

Why isnt there a politics forum here filled with solutions from the Democrats on how they would fix all the problems if what you say everything is wrong was correct? But all i see is mainly more negative attacks than anythign else. Your statement and the reality that i see here contradict.

You missed the point of many of those political threads......the beginning of the solution for the problems is to Dump Bush.

[Redneck4sure]

and to be fair, I found of pic of Bush's airplane when he turned it back in.

[NullsRevenge]

Why isnt there a politics forum here filled with solutions from the Democrats on how they would fix all the problems if what you say everything is wrong was correct? But all i see is mainly more negative attacks than anythign else. Your statement and the reality that i see here contradict.

You mised the point of many of those political threads......the beginning of the solution for the problems is to Dump Bush.

But you see people need a reason, whats the point in "dumping bush" if the next person isnt going to be any better? And simply not being Bush or how badly Bush is doing isnt good enough of a reason and this whole well tell you our solution after you vote for us is pretty sad because i think people ought to know what the people they elect to office are going to do.

If anything to dump bush would just be symbolic.

Edited May 9, 2004 by NullsRevenge